Wednesday, November 30, 2011

Pius X Society says Vatican's current offer not acceptable

The SSPX Liturgical Carnaval in Econe led by a canonical and liturgical rebel Fellay... This must have been Satan's look when he appears as an angel of light.

.- The Superior General of the Society of St. Pius X says he will inform the Vatican “in the next few days” that they cannot give the doctrinal reassurances required of them to advance reconciliation with the Catholic Church.

“It is true that this Doctrinal Preamble cannot receive our endorsement,” said Bishop Bernard Fellay on the society’s website, Nov. 28. 

However, Bishop Fellay said his understanding is that the document is “not a definite text” and that it “can be clarified and modified.” In particular, he would like to discuss what the Vatican means when it says that there is “leeway” for a “legitimate discussion” on the documents and legacy of the Second Vatican Council.

“What is the extent of this leeway? The proposal that I will make in the next few days to the Roman authorities and their response in turn will enable us to evaluate our remaining options,” he said.  

The breakaway Society of St. Pius X was presented with the “doctrinal preamble” or statement of principles by the Vatican’s Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith in September. 

The document outlined doctrinal points that the Vatican needs clarified before the 23-year rift between the two sides can be healed.  The society has been discussing its response for the past two months. 

Bishop Fellay said that to give a “flat refusal,” to the Vatican offer would be the “simplest thing, perhaps, but not the most courteous,” and since the note that accompanies it “foresees the possibility of making clarifications,” it seems “necessary to ask for them instead of refusing them a priori.” He added that this “in no way prejudges the response that we will give.” 

If the society agrees with the doctrinal preamble, they may be able to enter into the Church as a personal prelature—a jurisdiction without geographical boundaries designed to carry out particular pastoral initiatives.

But Bishop Fellay said that setting aside theological differences “in order to obtain a canonical status” would “expose” the society “to the danger of seeing the same differences crop up inevitably, which would make the canonical status not just precarious but quite simply unliveable.”
The Society of St. Pius X was founded by Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre in 1970 as a response to what he described as errors that had crept into the Catholic Church following the 1962-1965 Second Vatican Council. 

The society has had a strained relationship with the Vatican since Archbishop Lefebvre consecrated four bishops against the orders of Pope John Paul II in 1988.

FR. ABE:

SO BE IT! WE DON'T NEED THEM. WE ARE COMPLETE WITHOUT THE SSPX TRAITORS. WE ARE WASTING TIME AND RESOURCES FOR THESE FOLLOWERS OF LUCIFER-LUTHER-LEFEBVRE OF CURSED MEMORY.  IN ACTUALITY THEY ARE OUT OF THE CHURCH. THEIR DIALOGUE WITH US IS JUST A FRONT TO GAIN SEMBLANCE OF RESPECTABILITY. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH OF THE SSPX CHARADE.

9 comments:

  1. As hate spews from your mouth...

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  2. HATE? I DO NOT HATE THEM I JUST FIND THEM ABOMINABLE.

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  3. hypocrisy... from the Mouth of the SSPX they spew horrible words of hatred to our bishops calling them modernist and our pauline mass protestant.... HYPOCRISY YOU DO NOT WANT TO SHOW CHARITY BUT YOU WANT CHARITY BE SHOWED TO YOU!

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  4. "Often times they that were better in the judgement of men have been in greater danger by reason of their too great confidence.

    So that it is better for many not to be altogether free from temptations but to be often assaulted; that they may not be too secure lest, perhaps, they be lifted up with pride, or take more liberty to go aside after exterior comforts."

    My Imitation of Christ by Thomas Kemis.

    hindi ka ciguro nag babasa ng mga spiritual books kaya punong puno ka ng pride.

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  5. Father, if you find the Church's outreach to SSPX "ABOMINABLE", how then do you describe our dialogue with the Orthodox, Anglicans, Muslims and Jews?

    I honestly don't understand where this hatred ("ABOMINABLE") of yours come from when in fact we know that SSPX does not teach any DOCTRINE beyond what we know to be Catholic (prior to Vatican II). If we call the orthodox/protestant service a "prayer", why call an SSPX (valid but elicit) Mass a "Liturgical Carnaval" as if it is no prayer at all? If the Pope can give a pectoral cross to the heretical Archbishop of Canterbury, why can't we give the same honor to Fellay who has greater chance of uniting with the Church than Williams? Why do we single out the SSPX bishops and at the same time ignore the abominable acts of the eligitimate bishops in China?

    Honestly, I now find this hostility to SSPX unreasonable.

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  6. Hindi ba pagkamuhi iyang sinasabi mo? There are a lot more sensible things coming from SSPX than from most members of the hierarchy? Are you sure that Abp. Lefebvre is a follower of Luther? Reading most of the Vatican II sounds to me more Lutheran than Catholic. Sa tingin ko our problem with SSPX is a problem more of discipline. The Pope knew we cannot read Vatican II according to the "Spirit of Vatican II" because there is no "Spirit of Vatican II". When I was still in college I also hate SSPX dahil tingin ko they're a shame to the Catholic world but after reading some works or articles by Congar, Murray, Kung, Schillebeeckx, Rahner etc. men who had the greatest influence to the theology of Vatican II and comparing them with the Papal Encyclicals prior to Vatican II and the works of SSPX priests, well I became a "Lefevbrist" as they say. I suggest you open your eyes para malinawan ka.

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  7. [Hindi ba pagkamuhi iyang sinasabi mo?]

    KINAMUMUHIAN NG MGA CATOLICONG TAPAT SA SANTO PAPA ANG MGA EREHE, TRAIDORES AT MGA SCHISMATICONG LUMALABAN SA SANTA IGLESIA AT SA VICARIO NI CRISTO. IKAW? MINAMAHAL MO ANG MGA TRAIDOR SA SANTO PAPA?

    [ There are a lot more sensible things coming from SSPX than from most members of the hierarchy?]

    NICE STATEMENT. IT IS LIKE A PROSTITUTE INSULTING A VIRGIN. LIKE THE FALLEN ANGELS HAVING A 'HOLIER-THAN-THOU' ATTITUDE AGAINST THE HEAVENLY HOSTS.

    [Are you sure that Abp. Lefebvre is a follower of Luther?]

    YES I AM SURE. BOTH OF THEM REBELLED AGAINST THE POPE AND AGAINST THE CHURCH HIERARCHY AND BOTH REJECTED THE AUTHORITY OF AN ECUMENICAL COUNCIL. ARE YOU NOT SURE ABOUT THAT?

    [Reading most of the Vatican II sounds to me more Lutheran than Catholic.]

    IT MEANS YOU ARE IGNORANT OF BOTH LUTHERAN AND CATHOLIC THEOLOGY. THE VATICAN II FAITHFUL ARE THE ONES WHO ARE DEBATING THE LUTHERANS WHILE THE SSPX PRIESTS ARE ONLY SCRATCHING THEIR BALLS INSIDE THEIR ROMAN CHASUBLES.

    [Sa tingin ko our problem with SSPX is a problem more of discipline.]

    THE SSPX LED BY THEIR SENILE AND OLD FOOL LEFEBVRE DESTROYED ANY SENSE OF DISCIPLINE BY REBELLING AGAINST THE POPE AND THE HIERARCHY. THAT IS WHY IT IS THE HEIGHT OF HYPOCRISY FOR SSPX TO TALK OF DISCIPLINE. THEY ARE THE MOST UNDISCIPLINED LOT OUTSIDE THE CHURCH.

    [The Pope knew we cannot read Vatican II according to the "Spirit of Vatican II" because there is no "Spirit of Vatican II".]

    THERE IS ONLY ONE SPIRIT AND THAT ONE SPIRIT GUIDES THE CHURCH THROUGHOUT THE AGES AS SHE MAINTAINS HER DOCTRINES, MORALS AND DOGMAS AS WELL AS SHE IMPOSES CHANGES OR REVISIONS IN RITUALS, CODIFIED LAWS, ETC. THE SPIRIT OF SSPX IS THE SPIRIT OF REBELLION WHICH IS THE SPIRIT OF LUCIFER AND LUTHER.

    [When I was still in college I also hate SSPX dahil tingin ko they're a shame to the Catholic world but after reading some works or articles by Congar, Murray, Kung, Schillebeeckx, Rahner etc. men who had the greatest influence to the theology of Vatican II and comparing them with the Papal Encyclicals prior to Vatican II and the works of SSPX priests, well I became a "Lefevbrist" as they say.]

    I ALSO READ THE WORKS OF CONGAR, KUNG, RAHNER, ETC. BUT I AM NO FOOL LIKE YOU TO CONSIDER THEM AS THE AUTHORITY IN VATICAN II. THEIRS ARE MERE OPINIONS AND THEIR OPINIONS ARE THEIRS ALONE. THOSE OPINIONS LIVED AND DIED WITH THEM. BUT THE REAL AUTHORITY IN VATICAN II IS THE AUTHORITY OF THE VICAR OF CHRIST AND THE BISHOPS OF THE WORLD IN COMMUNION WITH HIM.

    [I suggest you open your eyes para malinawan ka.]

    MALINAW ANG ISIP KO AT MALINAW ANG AUTHORIDAD PARA SA AKIN. I AM WITH THE POPE AND YOU ARE WITH A REBEL TRAITOR, LEFEBVRE. MAGSAMA-SAMA KAYO NILA LEFEBVRE AT HANS KUNG SA IMPIERNO. DUON AKO SA MAY HAWAK NG SUSI NG KAHARIAN NG LANGIT!

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  8. [Father, if you find the Church's outreach to SSPX "ABOMINABLE", how then do you describe our dialogue with the Orthodox, Anglicans, Muslims and Jews?]

    HA HA HA... SSPX ARE REALLY VERY CUNNING IN TWISTING THINGS. IT IS THE SSPX ITSEFL - THE SOCIETY FOUNDED BY THEIR WACKY OLD FOOL LEFEBVRE - THAT IS ABOMINABLE AND NOT THE CHURCH DIALOGUE WITH OTHER RELIGION. THIS DIALOGUE IS GOOD. THAT IS THE GIFT OF THE SPIRIT TO THE CHURCH THROUGH THE SECOND VATICAN COUNCIL. BUT THE DEMONIC SSPX DOES NOT WANT THAT DIALOGUE. THEY HATE ECUMENISM AND THEY HATE INTER-RELIGIOUS DIALOGUE. THAT IS WHY THEY ARE DEMONIC.

    [I honestly don't understand where this hatred ("ABOMINABLE") of yours come from when in fact we know that SSPX does not teach any DOCTRINE beyond what we know to be Catholic (prior to Vatican II).]

    O NO, NO, NO... YOU ARE VERY DECEPTIVE.

    THE SSPX ARE TEACHING DOCTRINES CONTRARY TO PRE-VATICAN II PERIOD. SUCH AS:

    1. THEY ARE TEACHING CONTRARY TO VATICAN I WHEN THEY TEACH THAT THE POPE MUST BE DISOBEYED ON CANONICAL AND LITURGICAL MATTERS BECAUSE THE VATICAN I TEACHES THAT THE AUTHORITY OF THE POPE IS SUPREME AND ABSOLUTE IN THE CHURCH. THE SSPX IS NOT UNDER THE POPE BUT OF FELLAY. THAT IS WHY IT IS DEMONIC.

    2. THE SSPX ARE TEACHING CONTRARY TO ANCIENT CATHOLIC PRACTICE WHEN IT TEACHES THAT THEY HAVE A SUPPLIED JURISDICTION APART FROM THE BISHOPS AND THE POPE. THAT IS SOMETHING NEW. THEY HAVE DISTORTED THE MEANING OF JURISDICTION AND ECCLESIA SUPPLET.

    3. THE SSPX VIOLATE TRADITION WHEN IT REJECTS THE AUTHORITY OF THE SECOND VATICAN COUNCIL. ONLY THE POPE CAN REJECT A COUNCIL. ONLY THE POPE CAN DECLARE IT INVALID OR APOSTATE. ON THE CONTRARY THE POPE UPHELD THE COUNCIL AND PROMULGATED ALL ITS DECREES. THAT IS WHY THE SSPX IS A TRAITOR NOT ONLY TO THE POPE BUT ALSO TO TRADITION.

    [If we call the orthodox/protestant service a "prayer", why call an SSPX (valid but elicit) Mass a "Liturgical Carnaval" as if it is no prayer at all?]

    THE LITURGICAL CARNAVAL OF SSPX IS NICE ACCIDENTALLY BUT CANONICALLY IT IS A PRAYER OF TRAITORS. IMAGINE, THEY ARE MENTIONING THE NAME OF THE POPES IN THEIR MASSSES OR LITURGICAL CARNAVAL WHO FOR THEM ARE MODERNISTS. HA HA HA... SO THEIR MASSES ARE TAINTED BY MODERNISM. THEY ARE MENTIONING THE NAMES OF MODERNIST LEADER IN THEIR OWN MASSES.

    ON THE OTHER HAND, THEY CANNOT REMOVE HIS NAME IN THE MASS BECAUSE THEY DONT WANT TO BE POPELESS EVEN THOUGH CANONICALLY THEY ARE POPELESS. HA HA HA...

    POOR ABOMINABLE SSPX... THE SOCIETY OF THE POPELESS. HA HA HA...

    [If the Pope can give a pectoral cross to the heretical Archbishop of Canterbury, why can't we give the same honor to Fellay who has greater chance of uniting with the Church than Williams?]

    THE POPE IS IN DIALOGUE WITH A HERETIC. HIS GIFT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ANGLICAN HERESIES BUT IT WAS A GESTURE OF FRIENDSHIP. BUT FELLAY IS ANTI DIALOGUE AND ANTI ECUMNISM. WHY DO WE HAVE TO TALK WITH SOMEONE WHO IS AGAINST THE TALK? BESIDES FELLAY CLAIMS THAT HE IS CATHOLIC. IF HE IS A CATHOLIC THEN NO NEED FOR US TO TALK TO HIM BECAUSE HE JUST NEED TO OBEY THE POPE. BUT HE DOESN'T OBEY. SO, FELLAY IS MORE DANGEROUS AND MORE TREACHEROUS. HE IS NEITHER IN NOR OUT. HE IS LUKEWARM. HE MUST BE SPEWED.

    WITH THE ANGLICANS WE KNOW WHO AND WHAT THEY ARE. WITH FELLAY HE IS A CUNNING SERPENT WHO IS OUT YET PRETENDING TO BE IN... CLAIMING TO BE IN BUT ACTING AS IF OUT. IN OR OUT? CANONICALLY OUT. PRACTICALLY OUT. OFFICIALLY OUT.

    [Why do we single out the SSPX bishops and at the same time ignore the abominable acts of the eligitimate bishops in China?]

    HELLO. ARE YOU REAL? HA HA HA... THE SSPX IS NOT THE ONLY ISSUE HERE. THIS IS ONLY ONE OF THE FEW. HA HA HA... THE ILLIGITIMATE BISHOPS OF CHINA ARE AS EVIL AS THE ILLIGITIMATE BISHOPS OF SSPX. BOTH ARE CANONICAL AND LITURGICAL BASTARDS.

    [Honestly, I now find this hostility to SSPX unreasonable.]

    OUR REASONS ARE CLEAR. WE REJECT THE LITURGICAL BASTARDS EITHER FROM CHINA OR FROM SSPX.

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  9. [hindi ka ciguro nag babasa ng mga spiritual books kaya punong puno ka ng pride.]

    SI LUCIFER PUNONG PUNO NG PRIDE KAYA NAG REBELDE SA LANGIT.

    SI LUTHER PUNONG PUNO NG PRIDE KAYA NAG REBELDE SA POPE AT SA COUNCIL OF TRENT.

    SI LEFEBVRE AY PUNONG PUNO NG PRIDE KAYA NAG REBELDE SA POPE AT SA SECOND VATICAN COUNCIL.

    PRIDE = LUCIFER-LUTHER-LEFEBVRE!

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